[Sparrow]

Haven't seen one of these in a while so I thought I'd just help out any Terran players below masters league by outlining the current safe builds, these are the most stable builds to transition into the mid game as Terran vs every match up.

TvZ:

Reference: Fantasy vs Rouge

The old build: Reaper expand into fast 3CC with hellion pressure. This 3CC build has become difficult to execute as Zerg players almost always will roach bane all-in you if they get the opportunity. The 3CC builds of the past are far too greedy and require expert levels of defense into order to counter the most basic of roach bane all-ins.

The new build: CC first into hellions and banshees. Although it can be tricky to both micro your hellions as well as hit all your macro timings this build is by far the safest against any Zerg aggression. Yes I know it says CC first but when is the last time you saw a Zerg do a 10 or less pool against Terran, it just doesn't happen any more because the reaper opening hard counters it. Any pool later than a 10 pool won't be able to stop your CC from building on the low ground. This gives you a fast track into the mid game against Zerg, just make sure you get your wall up at your natural quickly as some Zergs get offended by you being so greedy and love to try to get a quick win with a baneling bust. Don't worry as long as you macro sufficiently you will have hellions to defend this.

The hellions main role in this build is to scout for any oncoming all-ins, you don't need to do any damage with them, you don't need to deny creep, you just need to keep them alive and scout. Once you're comfortable with this build you can start doing more aggressive pushes with the hellions however you will be more vulnerable to any Zerg timing attacks if you lose your hellions.

The banshees in this build are where you can get ahead or behind as you transition into the mid game. The banshees role is to skirt around the edges of the Zerg base picking off drones or queens who are too far away from spore crawlers, your goal is to take as little damage as possible from queens and spores. If you do take damage retreat to your hellions. The banshees secondary role (which is what makes this build so so safe) is to defend against any aggression the Zerg may do. This aggression will be scouted by your hellions while your banshees are flying around so as soon as you see anything just pull your banshees back to defend your base.

If you've macro'd correctly at home you should have a 3rd CC down and beginning to mine at 10:00, +1 attack and +1 armor upgrading and an 11:00 push with 2 medivacs and about 16 marines. If you've managed to keep both your banshees and hellions alive this is quite a sizable force and usually you win with this first push against any Zerg who miss macroed.
(tbc)

TvP:

The current build: Reaper expand into quick 3 barracks. This build is done by most pro players at the moment, however on ladder (particularly NA) you will find that the majority of Protoss will try to end the game rather quickly, and although the 3 barracks build may seem like, yess I'm getting out heaps of units it requires the Terran to have a high level of understand of Protoss openers as well as an expert level of unit position in order not to take damage from any early aggression, which at lower levels is quite common.

The safe build: Reaper expand into 4 minute engineering bay. This build is probably the most ladder safe build you can do, the fast engineering bay means that you can get down quick turrets in case you think your opponent may be going stargate or dts, you also get very early upgrades and have a strong +1 +1 timing attack when you reach the mid game. On top of all of this blink builds are very weak to this build as you get out a very fast factory and starport, meaning blink builds have less than a minute window to do any damage to you, rather than the usual 2 minutes for most other builds. It also means that if your opponent does go blink you have the opportunity to counter attack before colossus come into play. Same goes with any immortal build, you have the medivacs to defend.
(tbc)

TvT:

The current builds: TvT is an interesting match up because it has soo many strong openers. The gas first build can allow you to go into fast hellions, a fast widow mine drop, an early raven, a marine hellion elevator, or banshees, even more confusing is that you don't have to stop the aggression if you don't want to, you can stay on 1 base for a while, switch tech and if your opponent commits too much to their economy with out recognizing this, they will just straight up lose the game.

The banshee build: That is why I recommend learning this build as your staple TvT build, banshees are the highest aggressive tech unit you can get out from the gas first opener and if your opponent isn't prepared to face a banshee they will often times lose the game. Banshees also give you the opportunity to play greedy and take 3CCs quickly or to play aggressive and go for a 1 base tank push follow up. They are incredibly strong, versatile units.
(tbc)

I'll also be including Build orders shortly.

If you're interested in coaching email me at plutohnik@gmail.com my rate is $15/hr US.

[syfRize]

Nice guide so far mate!

Originally Posted by Sparrow

If you're interested in coaching email me at plutohnik@gmail.com my rate is $15/hr US.
Last edited by Sparrow; Today at 2:02 AM.

defs recommend this, always giving such insightful tips and whatnot in practice matches and is a high level terran! (rare breed in sea.. quick, use your master balls! o: )

[Sparrow]

I saw you were playing a bit or Terran hopefully this'll help a bit too I'll finish it off tomorrow so tired Z.Z

Quick Comments

syfRize:

Yeah I don't prac my Terran enough to know the meta and shit, this will help heaps man :) tyty

[Metalcore]

hmm, interesting, I haven't tried much cc first stuff for a while in tvz as i have been sticking with the old way of opening reaper into hellion banshee > mech. i may have to start experimenting with cc first again.

You are dead right bout the banshees though. if they don't have spores down preemtively, non stop banshee production can cost the zergs their third base and really slow them down and roach/ roach bane counter attacks get wrecked by the banshees so long as the hellions can buffer long enough for the banshees to get the damage done. Very good explanation though, i'm looking forward to your tvt write up.

[deth]

Having a CC first as a standard build sets you up to be exploitable. Zerg can adapt with early pools after playing you a couple of times, or shit, even a drone/ovie scout and set themselves up with 3 Hat before pool and you lose your entire advantage (see: Life vs Cure)

As to the other builds, hard to say before you write them out but a 4 minute blind ebay in TvP is going to delay timings and lose you map control if you're rushing turrets or just rushing an upgrade, unsure what you mean at this stage.

And a gas first banshee in TvT is very exploitable, gas first is still a great build but you can't be stubborn and JUST do banshees every game. Have to learn how to scout and adapt towards every possible situation with different unit compositions. If you're doing gas first banshee blind then you're going to lose a LOT.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by deth

Having a CC first as a standard build sets you up to be exploitable. Zerg can adapt with early pools after playing you a couple of times, or shit, even a drone/ovie scout and set themselves up with 3 Hat before pool and you lose your entire advantage (see: Life vs Cure)

As to the other builds, hard to say before you write them out but a 4 minute blind ebay in TvP is going to delay timings and lose you map control if you're rushing turrets or just rushing an upgrade, unsure what you mean at this stage.

And a gas first banshee in TvT is very exploitable, gas first is still a great build but you can't be stubborn and JUST do banshees every game. Have to learn how to scout and adapt towards every possible situation with different unit compositions. If you're doing gas first banshee blind then you're going to lose a LOT.

I completely agree with most of this if we're talking about a tournament setting, but in context of ladder most of this isn't relevant and people won't be trying to counter your build unless they know you're likely to do it. Sure if everyone begins to do CC first the meta will shift and we may start seeing earlier pools again but at the moment it's fine as it is just too risky to go for and earlier pool.

In that Life vs Cure example, in Lifes interview he stated that he already knew Cure was going to go for a 2 base build, cure must be known for it on ladder perhaps. Zerg going 3 hatch in response to Terran going CC first is not a hard counter, generally when you go CC first you scout for a fast third from the zerg however in that particular game cure did not. Banshee hellion harass is already strong against a 2 base Zerg opener, you have more opportunitys to do damage vs a 3.

ForGG goes engi bay at 4 minutes almost every game on ladder. Same as with gas first banshee, I don't think I need to go and find the stats for forGG's win rates.

[|Erasmus|]

forgg is also just better than 90% of people he plays on ladder... so he can afford to sacrifice efficiency for extra safety.

[Sparrow]

I wouldn't say it was less efficient, I would say that it is a smart play against the current Protoss meta. It does mean that you can't do those 8 minute pushes which punish a greedy Protoss, which is much less common than a cheesy Protoss. It also means you have a Stronger mid game timing than you would with a straight 3 barracks play. It is stronger because you have better upgrades and more starport units, which are arguably much more important than barracks units.

Quick Comments

Metalcore:

i agree, the amount of oracles i see in tvp... Rage inducing

[YGTjumpu]

Well done! very helpful

[Kreamy]

https://terrancraft.wordpress.com/20...-trend-in-tvp/

Fast ebay is old meta build but it is still viable to use and still pops up from time to time in pro games too

[Fullmetal]

I like how you talk about safe openers and explain their benefits, but the current builds are vastly superior assuming you correctly modify your build depending on the situation. I meet a lot of people that are very strong mechanically but fail to reach their potential due to their fears of taking risks. though it is true taking risks can be harmful if punished, a lot of the time it is quite easy to get away with cutting corners and taking some form of lead over your opponent. I first learned how crucial taking risks is when i started going 2 rax into a faster third In TvP. by doing so I can take a massive economic lead over my opponent and thus crush him with relative ease. although It is relatively easy for Protoss to scout your lack of a third rax and try to punish you for it by doing a timing attack or taking their own quick third, the protoss is still put into a position where he needs to take his own risk. and blah blah i know i've rambled a bit but still... morale of the story is~ TAKE RISKS, THEY ARE FREAKING PIVOTAL!

[Sparrow]

Taking risks is fine and can win you some games, however the current meta on both SEA and NA servers is quite aggressive, you'll probably come across an aggressive player over a macro player 80% of the time, these builds are tailored towards being safe because of that, meaning you'll have a higher win %. Sure you might get behind against a macro player, however you will almost always be ahead against an aggressive one.

[Fullmetal]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Taking risks is fine and can win you some games, however the current meta on both SEA and NA servers is quite aggressive, you'll probably come across an aggressive player over a macro player 80% of the time, these builds are tailored towards being safe because of that, meaning you'll have a higher win %. Sure you might get behind against a macro player, however you will almost always be ahead against an aggressive one.

i definately agree that the meta is quite aggro at the moment and it is very important to sacrifice extra economy in order to metagame your opponent (e.g double cloak banshee but delay 3rd cc so can hold roach/roach bane timings more easily).
But it is also important to remember the sheer importance of cutting as many corners as you can. Cutting corners such as not getting a bunker tvp and cutting corners like going for a fast 3cc can not only give you a huge economic edge over your opponent, but with good scouting you can often get away with cutting such corners.

[ToRChoboSniper]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Taking risks is fine and can win you some games, however the current meta on both SEA and NA servers is quite aggressive, you'll probably come across an aggressive player over a macro player 80% of the time, these builds are tailored towards being safe because of that, meaning you'll have a higher win %. Sure you might get behind against a macro player, however you will almost always be ahead against an aggressive one.

I honestly don't agree with this mindset at all, and I feel like practicing this way will severely hamper your ability to beat the best players in tournaments. I think it's self-explanatory that tailoring your playstyle to ladder opponents is not optimal unless you only care for your ladder rank, but playing extra safe and not cutting corners strikes me as lazy. IMO, it's important to continuosly push the envelope and develop yourself as a player, and with such a huge emphasis on safety and on your ladder opponents you're restricting yourself to a very narrow range of builds and disregarding some incredibly important aspects of the game.

[ShayneRarma]

Lets all just put someone down for trying to help lower league people with basic builds that will no doubt help them improve in some way.

Good way to get more people doing this kind of thing for the community. Well done. Not.

Or, you could post up alternative builds with justification why they would also help you improve your Tv? and thank Sparrow for taking his own time to help the community with his style (if you wish to call it that), noting that the builds he has posted would leave you exposed to x or y..

Regardless of what Sparrow posted, there is always going to be something you're exposed to, or something that you wont be improving in your game play. Hes not here coaching you, just giving an insight into what he sees as 'safe' ways to open in each match up. If you're good enough to be here scrutinizing his builds, chances are you're not going to be taking anything away from the post.

Quick Comments

	Pox:	Disagreeing is not putting someone down...
	Fullmetal:	I added my insight on the topic, i don't see what's wrong with that...

[|Erasmus|]

Noone's saying this is all bad... and the thread title itself says these builds are supposed to be safe.

If that doesn't leave the thread open to discussion about just how safe CC first is vs zerg, or whether safe builds are indeed the best way to open in general, I don't think I understand the purpose of a discussion forum.

Everything has been civil, and noone is saying that whatever work went into this is bad. Safe builds definitely have their place, but playing in a particularly safe manner is just as exploitable as playing extremely greedy, or aggressively.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by ToRChoboSniper

I honestly don't agree with this mindset at all, and I feel like practicing this way will severely hamper your ability to beat the best players in tournaments. I think it's self-explanatory that tailoring your playstyle to ladder opponents is not optimal unless you only care for your ladder rank, but playing extra safe and not cutting corners strikes me as lazy. IMO, it's important to continuosly push the envelope and develop yourself as a player, and with such a huge emphasis on safety and on your ladder opponents you're restricting yourself to a very narrow range of builds and disregarding some incredibly important aspects of the game.

As I mentioned in the first 2 lines of the post these builds are designed to transition you into a strong mid-game. They are not overly safe, however they do provide the means to defend against most early aggression from your opponent. I'm not saying you play like this every game, however I do feel that practicing builds where you should be able to defend aggression with is a good idea as even if you do them it's not a guaranteed win. You still have to learn positioning, not miss any of your macro timings, scout for what your opponent is doing and try to counter it. This play style (maybe not the build-order) is used by almost every pro kr terran, have a strong build and adapt to what your opponent is doing, if your opponent is playing standard then you have made it safely into the mid-game with no disadvantages.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by DynSL.Fullmetal

i definately agree that the meta is quite aggro at the moment and it is very important to sacrifice extra economy in order to metagame your opponent (e.g double cloak banshee but delay 3rd cc so can hold roach/roach bane timings more easily).
But it is also important to remember the sheer importance of cutting as many corners as you can. Cutting corners such as not getting a bunker tvp and cutting corners like going for a fast 3cc can not only give you a huge economic edge over your opponent, but with good scouting you can often get away with cutting such corners.

If you watch the linked game for the TvZ build, Fantasy does cut corners, he has a 3rd CC at 10:00 and a push at 11:00 which is faster than standard, as well as have 2 banshees. No one said anything about not cutting corners, safe does not mean over building defense. In Fantasy's case he uses units to pressure while scout, the units he uses to pressure are also used to defend any aggression. Behind his pressure he plays greedy because he knows everything that his opponent is doing.

[syfCabracan]

Originally Posted by ToRChoboSniper

I honestly don't agree with this mindset at all, and I feel like practicing this way will severely hamper your ability to beat the best players in tournaments. I think it's self-explanatory that tailoring your playstyle to ladder opponents is not optimal unless you only care for your ladder rank, but playing extra safe and not cutting corners strikes me as lazy. IMO, it's important to continuosly push the envelope and develop yourself as a player, and with such a huge emphasis on safety and on your ladder opponents you're restricting yourself to a very narrow range of builds and disregarding some incredibly important aspects of the game.

Echoing what Sparrow is saying, there is a difference between grinding the ladder and getting tournement ready. A lot of players are looking to improve their mmr to get a better level of practise from the ladder, so you grind up like this then develop your depth once you are against better opponents.